Post by jebe457 on Jul 7, 2015 4:05:39 GMT
My deck was unmastered and included Trial Mech(s) as I've been playing for roughly a month, and mostly have been working with IS Ravens/Locusts and Clan Novas when I was invited to join. I participated in drops against the 228th, BMMU, KCom, and MercStar 11-12 man units in addition to lesser outfits during the event and these are my thoughts.
On the proper us of LRMs
From what I've seen of how things work in actual practice, there's no point to bringing a dedicated LRM boat to Community Warfare. In MWO there's a sequence of events that must occur in order for LRMs to do their thing. Someone has to have a consistant line of sight on the target, in order to potentially achieve lock. This in turn means the target also has line of sight on the spotter. If they have ECM coverage, someone needs to counter that ECM by carrying a BAP, ECM in counter mode, or popping a UAV which most opponents will shoot down shortly after noticing.
Now from my perspective LRMs are one of most misunderstood weapons in MWO. In theory you can pummel a 'Mech to scrap with LRMs, but the likelihood of you successfully setting up the entire sequence required to do that consistently is very low. As a result while doing damage with LRMs is part of the job, it's not actually the main purpose of LRMs. Instead I'd argue that main purpose of LRMs is to disrupt and psych out an opponent.
I'd argue the Hunchback 4J is ideal for fulfilling how this role works in actual practice. Due to the Quirks a Hunchback 4J, can keep up an almost continuous stream of LRM 10 blobs using chain fire. That means the person on the receiving end of those LRMs is not only going to have the incoming missile alarm screaming at them, but if they actually hit is going to not be in a position to target your teammates effectively.
The Hunchback 4J has another characteristic that makes it ideal for LRM usage. It's low profile, fairly mobile, and can carry 5 MLs with a 250 STD, BAP, and 4 tons of ammo for those LRM 10s. Unlike a Catapult a Hunchback doesn't scream "Kill Me!" to the enemy team, and those 5 MLs mean you can brawl with an empty side in between LRMing targets of opportunity. LRMing is an important part of the battlefield calculus of MWO but you will never be able to setup the LRM murderfield ideal against any kind of semi-competent opponent, and they will actively hunt anything that's obviously an LRM boat.
Running LRMs effectively thus calls for situational awareness. You will need to be have a feel for how your LRMs arc, and whether there's a reasonable window for them to get from you to your target. If you misjudge you need to be paying enough attention to see the missiles slamming into terrain, and correct as appropriate by either shifting position so they'll hit or changing targets. This LRM targeting approach needs to be mixed up with maneuvering around, managing cover, and lasering targets of opportunity. Again you're not going to be able to stand in the back and hold down the fire button to make the enemy go away. Trying to do that will just result in you being isolated and killed.
Proper use of Ballistics
I ran a Firebrand with 2x Large Lasers and 2x AC/5s with a STD engine near max armor, 5 tons of ammo, and Adv. Zoom. While lasers are good for doing damage ballistics are good at disrupting the target, and in most of the runs I found this Mech was very good at putting down mechs with direct firepower, and getting Mechs to back off from their sniping positions. While part of this is due to the damage output of this being equivalent to a 4x Large Laser build, I think part of this is also that AC/5s are disruptive to the target on the other end which combined with the damage is okay at getting them to back off.
Hence while Ballistics are good from a heat management and damage perspective, they're also good for screwing with the enemy's ability to operate effectively which lasers don't replicate.
Thoughts on build optimization
From what I saw of people's builds, there were a lot of Thunderbolts boating exactly one weapon type whether it was 9Ses with ER PPCs, 5SSes with MPLs, or otherwise. Associated with this when doing the trenchrun down a certain map I noticed that most of the Battlemech Company was not firing at the enemy Clanners on the ridges, and my Riflebrand was largely alone in pushing them off. Now I get it those highly optimized builds are really, really good at putting out DPS at range X. I've run the absurd DPS Nova build, I get it.
The thing is though when you're in CW you have these things called Lancemates who should be helping you with putting DPS on targets, and if you're working together opponents will go down quickly. That brings us to why this is a problem. If you're running down the trenches with snipers in the wings, and everyone has 5SS with pure MPLs then you're going to get shot to bits until a few of you close range. In turn if you have a bunch of people with 3x ER PPC TDR-9S builds then they can help with pounding away while closing, but are going to be running way to hot once the Company has closed with the enemy to brawl with shorter ranged but more energy efficient weapons.
So if I may make a humble suggestion, let's say instead of the super optimized builds you ran a 9S build something like this:
mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab#i=155&l=6057b891d0632d62ae42493cfe02afee5589c5a1
And a 5SS build something like this*:
mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab#i=115&l=2fdd0d0d78da534e3546fac4f2cb795a2985e7d9
*The only MPL specific quirk for the 5SS gives MPLs 330 meter range. The general energy quirks of the chassis when applied to MLs gives them an optimum 337.5 meter range and your ER Large Lasers an 843.75 meter optimum range. That means you actually outrange Clanners in this.
Now both of these builds have a pair of high mounted ER Large lasers in the side torso which means they can contribute meaningfully to pushing those clanners off the ridges on the way in via hill humping and potshots of opportunity on the way in. As the Company close these builds have 4-5 MLs and an SRM4 to engage targets at brawling range with reasonable heat. As a result these platforms are relevant during the initial part of approaching the enemy where long range firepower is needed, and remain relevant as the Company closes instead of only really being useful at one or the other.
Personally I'd argue flexibility and relevance at all ranges outweighs the slight advantages pure builds offer in a CW context where you're operating as a group. That 3rd ER PPC is only really offering a 50% better alpha at range if you can finagle the one that's not on your shoulder into a position where it would actually hit the enemy. Is that 7 MPL build might have a suite 42 alpha for 2-3 bursts, but is it really that good versus a 28 alpha with MGs or a 33 alpha when the team is getting shot up because they have to wait for you to close range before you can contribute? With a pair of 'Mechs is 40 at range between two 'Mechs inferior to 30 from one? With a pair of Mechs is a 56 alpha with 4MGs inferior to an alpha of 42 and guy that's struggling to not overheat with his 3x ER PPC build now that things are in his face? I'm not in a position to dictate to anyone, but it's something to think about.
On the proper us of LRMs
From what I've seen of how things work in actual practice, there's no point to bringing a dedicated LRM boat to Community Warfare. In MWO there's a sequence of events that must occur in order for LRMs to do their thing. Someone has to have a consistant line of sight on the target, in order to potentially achieve lock. This in turn means the target also has line of sight on the spotter. If they have ECM coverage, someone needs to counter that ECM by carrying a BAP, ECM in counter mode, or popping a UAV which most opponents will shoot down shortly after noticing.
Now from my perspective LRMs are one of most misunderstood weapons in MWO. In theory you can pummel a 'Mech to scrap with LRMs, but the likelihood of you successfully setting up the entire sequence required to do that consistently is very low. As a result while doing damage with LRMs is part of the job, it's not actually the main purpose of LRMs. Instead I'd argue that main purpose of LRMs is to disrupt and psych out an opponent.
I'd argue the Hunchback 4J is ideal for fulfilling how this role works in actual practice. Due to the Quirks a Hunchback 4J, can keep up an almost continuous stream of LRM 10 blobs using chain fire. That means the person on the receiving end of those LRMs is not only going to have the incoming missile alarm screaming at them, but if they actually hit is going to not be in a position to target your teammates effectively.
The Hunchback 4J has another characteristic that makes it ideal for LRM usage. It's low profile, fairly mobile, and can carry 5 MLs with a 250 STD, BAP, and 4 tons of ammo for those LRM 10s. Unlike a Catapult a Hunchback doesn't scream "Kill Me!" to the enemy team, and those 5 MLs mean you can brawl with an empty side in between LRMing targets of opportunity. LRMing is an important part of the battlefield calculus of MWO but you will never be able to setup the LRM murderfield ideal against any kind of semi-competent opponent, and they will actively hunt anything that's obviously an LRM boat.
Running LRMs effectively thus calls for situational awareness. You will need to be have a feel for how your LRMs arc, and whether there's a reasonable window for them to get from you to your target. If you misjudge you need to be paying enough attention to see the missiles slamming into terrain, and correct as appropriate by either shifting position so they'll hit or changing targets. This LRM targeting approach needs to be mixed up with maneuvering around, managing cover, and lasering targets of opportunity. Again you're not going to be able to stand in the back and hold down the fire button to make the enemy go away. Trying to do that will just result in you being isolated and killed.
Proper use of Ballistics
I ran a Firebrand with 2x Large Lasers and 2x AC/5s with a STD engine near max armor, 5 tons of ammo, and Adv. Zoom. While lasers are good for doing damage ballistics are good at disrupting the target, and in most of the runs I found this Mech was very good at putting down mechs with direct firepower, and getting Mechs to back off from their sniping positions. While part of this is due to the damage output of this being equivalent to a 4x Large Laser build, I think part of this is also that AC/5s are disruptive to the target on the other end which combined with the damage is okay at getting them to back off.
Hence while Ballistics are good from a heat management and damage perspective, they're also good for screwing with the enemy's ability to operate effectively which lasers don't replicate.
Thoughts on build optimization
From what I saw of people's builds, there were a lot of Thunderbolts boating exactly one weapon type whether it was 9Ses with ER PPCs, 5SSes with MPLs, or otherwise. Associated with this when doing the trenchrun down a certain map I noticed that most of the Battlemech Company was not firing at the enemy Clanners on the ridges, and my Riflebrand was largely alone in pushing them off. Now I get it those highly optimized builds are really, really good at putting out DPS at range X. I've run the absurd DPS Nova build, I get it.
The thing is though when you're in CW you have these things called Lancemates who should be helping you with putting DPS on targets, and if you're working together opponents will go down quickly. That brings us to why this is a problem. If you're running down the trenches with snipers in the wings, and everyone has 5SS with pure MPLs then you're going to get shot to bits until a few of you close range. In turn if you have a bunch of people with 3x ER PPC TDR-9S builds then they can help with pounding away while closing, but are going to be running way to hot once the Company has closed with the enemy to brawl with shorter ranged but more energy efficient weapons.
So if I may make a humble suggestion, let's say instead of the super optimized builds you ran a 9S build something like this:
mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab#i=155&l=6057b891d0632d62ae42493cfe02afee5589c5a1
And a 5SS build something like this*:
mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab#i=115&l=2fdd0d0d78da534e3546fac4f2cb795a2985e7d9
*The only MPL specific quirk for the 5SS gives MPLs 330 meter range. The general energy quirks of the chassis when applied to MLs gives them an optimum 337.5 meter range and your ER Large Lasers an 843.75 meter optimum range. That means you actually outrange Clanners in this.
Now both of these builds have a pair of high mounted ER Large lasers in the side torso which means they can contribute meaningfully to pushing those clanners off the ridges on the way in via hill humping and potshots of opportunity on the way in. As the Company close these builds have 4-5 MLs and an SRM4 to engage targets at brawling range with reasonable heat. As a result these platforms are relevant during the initial part of approaching the enemy where long range firepower is needed, and remain relevant as the Company closes instead of only really being useful at one or the other.
Personally I'd argue flexibility and relevance at all ranges outweighs the slight advantages pure builds offer in a CW context where you're operating as a group. That 3rd ER PPC is only really offering a 50% better alpha at range if you can finagle the one that's not on your shoulder into a position where it would actually hit the enemy. Is that 7 MPL build might have a suite 42 alpha for 2-3 bursts, but is it really that good versus a 28 alpha with MGs or a 33 alpha when the team is getting shot up because they have to wait for you to close range before you can contribute? With a pair of 'Mechs is 40 at range between two 'Mechs inferior to 30 from one? With a pair of Mechs is a 56 alpha with 4MGs inferior to an alpha of 42 and guy that's struggling to not overheat with his 3x ER PPC build now that things are in his face? I'm not in a position to dictate to anyone, but it's something to think about.
